Here's the NRA's logic: They believe that NICS keeps guns out of the hands of violent criminals who shouldn't be allowed to own guns. It never crossed their minds that maybe these violent criminals shouldn't be allowed to be in the population of the citizen body.
It's because the way to get rid of regulations that don't work is you attack them one by one. You focus on one item and reach your goal to move onto the next one.
Living in Illinois I think there are a lot bigger fish to fry before we get rid of NICS.
I'm not sure about every other state but I'm still waiting 24 hours for a long gun and 72 for a handgun. I'm glad that we have been able to fight off one gun a month too.
Of course I'm not happy with every choice that the NRA makes but that is also why there are groups that go from one extreme to the other.
Here's what I've found on NICS - http://www.nraila.org/Issues/factsheets/read.aspx?ID=82
Now hold on, Chris--you made a claim and I asked you to follow it up with what happens next once the first incremental goal is completed. I was quite careful to qualify my question to you in terms of "what's next along those lines"?
That excludes frying fish in Illinois.
I think you mistook my rhetorical "why?" for a request to be informed on what NICS is about. I hope you don't think I need a fact sheet from Fairfax to get up to speed.
I am asking why NRA SUPPORTS NICS.
And note I'm not asking why they prefer instant check over a waiting period. I'm not asking about NICS being perceived as the best we can do in today's political climate.
I'll e-mail you my thought about why "NRA supports NICS"
As to posting the fact sheet that was a response to you asking "When was NICS implemented?" Which I figured was you asking me to do some NICS research.
In response to the question "What is the next step along those lines, what is the goal?":
"What is the next step along those lines, what is the goal?"
While I do not know what the goal is or what it should be. My personal goal would be to at least have Vermont style LTC everywhere and incorporation.
Now here is my "if I were King" response to what the next step would be.
If I were in charge of the NRA Budget, I would first limit mailing to members to be a few to about your state and national legal issues to be aware about. Offer members a discount on membership if they "opt-out" of mailing to be e-mail only. I believe this would cut costs greatly.
Now with my "budget surplus" I would then begin two programs that's goal would be to educate the general public and firearm owners who are not active in politics.
First would be a program through general advertising my thought would be to look at movie theater advertising. You could touch on all sorts of defensive issues and etc. Use images such as Oleg Volk's pictures; show people even talking about how they were able to defend themselves, sporting issues, Eddie eagle, etc.
Second would be to have a program that would help fund a grassroots push for education. Such as having booths at different kinds of expos and county fair; rally's in larger cities, etc. This would be to talk about defensive uses of firearms, training opportunities and politics.
I too, would like to ask the same question ... Why do they endorse it?
If getting rid of the NICS is a future goal (regardless if it is stated or hidden) of the NRA, how in the world will they ever reconcile their present stance of stated "support" for it when they try to abolish it?
I suppose it would really suck to know (and say) exactly what you want from the very beginning. You might get labled as intolerable, stubborn or even accused of not being a team player.
The reason I asked "When?" was to illustrate how if this is but one step on the way to a goal that it's about time we at least found out what the next step was.
In fact, NICS is the end goal they support, and my original question remains:
Why?
It's not like it stops dangerous criminals from getting guns.
"While I do not know what the goal is or what it should be. My personal goal would be to at least have Vermont style LTC everywhere and incorporation."
so? the founders thought everyone should have a small representative government, with limited power. the sheriff was the only person in a county with arresting power. the government was forbidden from printing paper money. the president was selected by the electoral college, and the runner up was the vice president. the commoner had little if any taxes to pay.
if this nice, limited system was so great, why did rhode island resist ratifying the constitution until they were threatened with invasion?
An ancillary point: NRA members can opt out of the mailing. I did for years. I suggest you don't, since your member ID is printed on the label, and that is handy at times when your card is lost. :o)
I had the opportunity to sit down and speak to my representative on the NRA Board. Currently the NRA spends approximately sixty percent of its treasure chest on education and other types of outreach, and the balance on legislative efforts. Do we really want that to change? While we are encumbered with state-mandated tests of fitness, I prefer the NRA be the largest supplier of instruction, rather than the ignorant dingbats who saddle us with restrictions reflecting their uninformed opinions of "gun safety". (Think of the ratio of state flunkies who discover just-went-off-guns, as opposed to NRA instructors in your area.)
I apologize in advance since I am uninvited, but I will take a stab at the answer:
Because the NRA's opinion reflects that of its members.
Because the NRA's opinion reflects that of its members.
Nope, the NRA uses it's members to generate cash and that's about the end of it. W/out NICS there's no hysteria to "justify" the mailings and pleas for more cash.
I am the NRA, and I send them dues but anything above that goes to the REAL RKBA organizations.
Here's the NRA's logic: They believe that NICS keeps guns out of the hands of violent criminals who shouldn't be allowed to own guns.
ReplyDeleteIt never crossed their minds that maybe these violent criminals shouldn't be allowed to be in the population of the citizen body.
Because the NRA is pragmatic.
ReplyDeleteIt's because the way to get rid of regulations that don't work is you attack them one by one. You focus on one item and reach your goal to move onto the next one.
ReplyDeleteReally, Chris?
ReplyDeleteWhen was NICS implemented?
What is the next step along those lines, what is the goal?
Living in Illinois I think there are a lot bigger fish to fry before we get rid of NICS.
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure about every other state but I'm still waiting 24 hours for a long gun and 72 for a handgun. I'm glad that we have been able to fight off one gun a month too.
Of course I'm not happy with every choice that the NRA makes but that is also why there are groups that go from one extreme to the other.
Here's what I've found on NICS - http://www.nraila.org/Issues/factsheets/read.aspx?ID=82
Now hold on, Chris--you made a claim and I asked you to follow it up with what happens next once the first incremental goal is completed. I was quite careful to qualify my question to you in terms of "what's next along those lines"?
ReplyDeleteThat excludes frying fish in Illinois.
I think you mistook my rhetorical "why?" for a request to be informed on what NICS is about. I hope you don't think I need a fact sheet from Fairfax to get up to speed.
I am asking why NRA SUPPORTS NICS.
And note I'm not asking why they prefer instant check over a waiting period. I'm not asking about NICS being perceived as the best we can do in today's political climate.
I'm asking why they endorse it.
I'll e-mail you my thought about why "NRA supports NICS"
ReplyDeleteAs to posting the fact sheet that was a response to you asking "When was NICS implemented?" Which I figured was you asking me to do some NICS research.
In response to the question "What is the next step along those lines, what is the goal?":
"What is the next step along those lines, what is the goal?"
While I do not know what the goal is or what it should be. My personal goal would be to at least have Vermont style LTC everywhere and incorporation.
Now here is my "if I were King" response to what the next step would be.
If I were in charge of the NRA Budget, I would first limit mailing to members to be a few to about your state and national legal issues to be aware about. Offer members a discount on membership if they "opt-out" of mailing to be e-mail only. I believe this would cut costs greatly.
Now with my "budget surplus" I would then begin two programs that's goal would be to educate the general public and firearm owners who are not active in politics.
First would be a program through general advertising my thought would be to look at movie theater advertising. You could touch on all sorts of defensive issues and etc. Use images such as Oleg Volk's pictures; show people even talking about how they were able to defend themselves, sporting issues, Eddie eagle, etc.
Second would be to have a program that would help fund a grassroots push for education. Such as having booths at different kinds of expos and county fair; rally's in larger cities, etc. This would be to talk about defensive uses of firearms, training opportunities and politics.
I too, would like to ask the same question ... Why do they endorse it?
ReplyDeleteIf getting rid of the NICS is a future goal (regardless if it is stated or hidden) of the NRA, how in the world will they ever reconcile their present stance of stated "support" for it when they try to abolish it?
I suppose it would really suck to know (and say) exactly what you want from the very beginning. You might get labled as intolerable, stubborn or even accused of not being a team player.
Ah.
ReplyDeleteThe reason I asked "When?" was to illustrate how if this is but one step on the way to a goal that it's about time we at least found out what the next step was.
In fact, NICS is the end goal they support, and my original question remains:
Why?
It's not like it stops dangerous criminals from getting guns.
"While I do not know what the goal is or what it should be. My personal goal would be to at least have Vermont style LTC everywhere and incorporation."
ReplyDeleteso? the founders thought everyone should have a small representative government, with limited power. the sheriff was the only person in a county with arresting power. the government was forbidden from printing paper money. the president was selected by the electoral college, and the runner up was the vice president. the commoner had little if any taxes to pay.
if this nice, limited system was so great, why did rhode island resist ratifying the constitution until they were threatened with invasion?
you might call it a matter of principle.
My question for Chris is: Are you from Illinois or Somewhere in the Carolinas?
ReplyDeleteYour profile isn't showing where you're at.
CIII
I'm from the western burbs of Chicago; I updated my blogger profile now.
ReplyDeleteAn ancillary point: NRA members can opt out of the mailing. I did for years. I suggest you don't, since your member ID is printed on the label, and that is handy at times when your card is lost. :o)
ReplyDeleteI had the opportunity to sit down and speak to my representative on the NRA Board. Currently the NRA spends approximately sixty percent of its treasure chest on education and other types of outreach, and the balance on legislative efforts. Do we really want that to change? While we are encumbered with state-mandated tests of fitness, I prefer the NRA be the largest supplier of instruction, rather than the ignorant dingbats who saddle us with restrictions reflecting their uninformed opinions of "gun safety". (Think of the ratio of state flunkies who discover just-went-off-guns, as opposed to NRA instructors in your area.)
I apologize in advance since I am uninvited, but I will take a stab at the answer:
Because the NRA's opinion reflects that of its members.
TJP said:
ReplyDeleteBecause the NRA's opinion reflects that of its members.
Nope, the NRA uses it's members to generate cash and that's about the end of it. W/out NICS there's no hysteria to "justify" the mailings and pleas for more cash.
I am the NRA, and I send them dues but anything above that goes to the REAL RKBA organizations.
JPFO, GOA, etc