Winchester secured a Homeland Security contract for up to 200 million rounds of .40 S&W, ammo that will be used by Immigrations, Customs and Enforcement. The load is a 135-grain hollowpoint. No ballistics are available as this load is not yet cataloged, but it will fall under the Winchester Ranger brand. [More]I'd be interested in knowing the time period/quantities/shipment intervals the contract specifies.
[Via PolyKahr]
14 comments:
So, Winchester is NOT going to follow Ron Barrett's example, eh? I'm sorry to hear that.
200,000,000 rounds for 15,000 employees comes out to over 13,000 rounds of hollowpoint carry ammo per employee. Either they are they planning on hiring a lot more people sometime soon, or this is a buyout. Or both.
Well, there's one other possibility...that'll give 'em what, 800...?
Using strictly the official philosophies in sway at this time, and in view of their inability to not project their intentions onto others, it sounds to me like mass planned murder is afoot.
Do not ridicule the above, unless you are willing to dispute the official government postion as regards the keeping and bearing of arms by the ordinary citizen. Think of it, 200,000,000 rounds is enough to kill every adult in America. To turn their own questions back on them, "Why do they need that much ammunition for just one type and caliber of firearm in the employ of government?". "Why would they need other calibers, and how much ammunition must they have cached in all calibers and applications?" "Would not public safety demand a restriction on the amount of ammunition in government hands at any one time?" "Why would honest and honorable government agents object to waiting periods, registration of arms and ammo, serialization of each round and specific person such ammunition is issued to?"
Unless of course, planned mass murder is their goal. If they can suspect the average citizen of such intent, over much less logistical preparation, how can we not suspect them of worse, when unlike us, they have been trained to believe in their super citizen status and immunity from the laws that we routinely obey?"
We need to stop imbuing these people with unproven moral motives. They have proven to be far less moral than the average citizen.
the article doesn't link to the contract but i think it's obvious that they're not getting all 200 million at the same time. this is perhaps a contract to deliver 2 million rounds per month for 100 months, or some such agreement.
a government cannot calculate how many rounds of ammo it will need to outfit its armies. it cannot do this any worse or better than it can administrate healthcare. command economies do not work.
if anything, a surplus of this ammo would just sit in an armory, hoarded, in the old days. today, governments buy contracts in terms of futures -- and overproduction is simply not delivered. winchester will be sitting on the ammo and the feds won't pay for it beyond what they already had to have winchester manufacture it.
this is why you see lots of "police and military only" ammo overrun lots on certain wholesalers' and retailers' websites, when in fact there is no law preventing any american from buying and using it. winchester may stick to its guns but after the government has screwed them, the buck is passed to warehousing and to logistics, and so wholesalers need to move it to survive.
in a command economy, in the long run, they don't. and in the long run, this failure becomes a crime against the state.
David, I know it's snark, but I can't parse it. How does "rounds per insurgent killed" translate to "rounds per agent fielded"?
If you are implying that they are bad shots, you might want to consider that the vast majority share of the recent massive ammunition purchases for our armed forces were not used in combat, but in training. We have hundreds of thousands of soldiers, training ammunition use adds up.
ICE is a much smaller force, and this is not training ammo.
"David, I know it's snark, but I can't parse it. How does "rounds per insurgent killed" translate to "rounds per agent fielded"?"
I think I get it. The massive ammunition buy is a "Lesson Learned" from the huge amounts of ammunition required to suppress a civil insurrection in a foreign country. HSA is planning for a civil insurrection here and therefore is buying supplies in advance. Makes sense really, because after the ball drops ammunition and arms manufacturers will be prime targets for both sides.
The ballistics on this round should be interesting when the information becomes available. Prevalent .40 S&W JHP rounds currently manufactured are 155-165 gr., with some 135 gr. rounds available from CorBon and others. The lighter bullet weight usually results in higher velocity, higher foot pounds of energy, and improved expansion on impact with lighter recoil while still providing adequate barrier penetration. Yes, there are 180+ gr. rounds out there, just as there are 147 gr. JHP rounds for 9mm vs. the 115-124 gr. rounds used by LE.
If the contract duration is ten years, then the 200 million quantity works out to 1300 rounds per year per shooter for 15,000 shooters.
I was also wondering about the ballistics. The bullet weight was the first thing that caught my eye. I was thinking of something like the Federal EFMJ or (already mentioned) the CorBon DPX. I wonder if they've come up with something new?
Uh, guys, Y'know, all these agencies have to qualify 3-4 times a year, and Homeland runs the FLETC training center where they have multiple ranges and bust millions of caps a year. This may be nothing more sinister than that, i.e. what they would normally burn up anyway. But on the other hand, one never knows...
Diplomacy - by other means.
According to this site:
www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/hspd-12_quarterly_report_june_2009.pdf
There's almost 19,000 ICE personal (although I have no not bother researching how many need to be armed and trained). Like Jon said, this is likely a contract for several years, I figure 5 at the minimum, but likely 10. Considering the Feds have 1,000 people at their training center alone, I bet the ICE training uses lots of ammo.
Personally, I don't find anything alarming about this, I think it's likely a abnormally high purchase due to anti-terrorism authorization dollars being spent within a narrowly defined category. I do, however, find it ridiculous and an example of government waste - I suppose it would be environmentally friendly and less expensive to hire a small business to just reload training brass.
Using Fidelity's revised number of 19,000 instead of 15,000, then let's recalculate.
If the contract duration is ten years, then the 200 million quantity works out to 1050 rounds per year per shooter for 19,000 shooters.
If each shooter qualifies twice per year and consumes 400-500 rounds per qualification, then the 1050 rounds per year appears normal. Initial training will require more rounds. See www.frontsight.com for an estimate of ammunition consumption for a civilian training course for proficiency.
How many readers of this Web site consume 500 rounds or more per year? Shooting two boxes of 50 rounds per month to maintain proficiency times 12 months equals 1200 rounds. Even lowering the frequency to shooting every other month burns 600 rounds per year.
Having a hot, fast .40 S&W load available at contract leftover pricing will be good once the novelty wears off.
You can now buy 500 rounds of contract leftover Winchester Ranger 124 gr. NATO headstamped 9mm rounds for $159 shipped, which is a similar cost to Speer Lawman 124 gr. or Federal Eagle 124 gr. ammo. The Ranger packaging clearly states:
"FOR LAW ENFORCEMENT USE ONLY
NOT FOR RETAIL SALE
PRESSURE LEVELS EXCEED INDUSTRY STANDARDS"
The NATO pressure standard for this round is approximately that of 9mm+P. So if you have a modern 9mm like a Beretta or a Sig, then your weapon should function nicely. Just make sure that you replace your springs on a regular schedule with the hotter load.
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